DECT phone (Panasonic) is not displaying calling number (or name from address book) any more: used to work until the clocks went back

[NY]

My parents have a Panasonic KX-TGJ420E DECT phone with multiple handsets.
Until recently it has displayed the phone number (and if possible, the
corresponding name from the phone's address book) for any incoming call.

My mum went into the menus to change the time by an hour on Sunday, and
since then it only displays the text "Incoming call" with no actual number.
I can't see anything in the menus that could turn on and off the display of
the number; the only configurable option is "Talking Caller ID" where a
voice synthesiser reads out the info (that feature is turned off and always
has been). The fault exists on all the handsets, so it's not a
handset-specific problem.

One interesting thing: I got mum to change the time so it was incorrect by a
few minutes and then call the phone from her mobile. This should have
corrected the time to "now" because that info is contained within the Caller
ID data packet. But it didn't.

The only thing that she has not been able to test yet is to try a different
phone (the old DECT phone which I think was BT8500) to see if that displays
caller ID.

Is it possible that her phone provider (Plusnet, rather than BT) could
inadvertently have turned off Caller ID on their line during the change in
the hour? Can that happen - ie is it a plausible suggestion?

[Jeff Layman]

Post by NY
My parents have a Panasonic KX-TGJ420E DECT phone with multiple handsets.
Until recently it has displayed the phone number (and if possible, the
corresponding name from the phone's address book) for any incoming call.
My mum went into the menus to change the time by an hour on Sunday, and
since then it only displays the text "Incoming call" with no actual number.
I can't see anything in the menus that could turn on and off the display of
the number; the only configurable option is "Talking Caller ID" where a
voice synthesiser reads out the info (that feature is turned off and always
has been). The fault exists on all the handsets, so it's not a
handset-specific problem.
One interesting thing: I got mum to change the time so it was incorrect by a
few minutes and then call the phone from her mobile. This should have
corrected the time to "now" because that info is contained within the Caller
ID data packet. But it didn't.
The only thing that she has not been able to test yet is to try a different
phone (the old DECT phone which I think was BT8500) to see if that displays
caller ID.
Is it possible that her phone provider (Plusnet, rather than BT) could
inadvertently have turned off Caller ID on their line during the change in
the hour? Can that happen - ie is it a plausible suggestion?

We've got a KX-TG8061E. If yours is similar, their might be some display
options not accessible through the usual menu. Perhaps you can can
access these through the middle soft key (directly below the display).
Press the key and then #192.

I think there are other options through the soft key and #nnn codes, but
don't know if these (or even #192) will be of any help.

It might be worth a call to the Panasonic Dect helpline (0844 8443899
according to the manual, but it is 8 years old!) if you can't get it sorted.

[Woody]

Post by Jeff Layman

Post by NY
My parents have a Panasonic KX-TGJ420E DECT phone with multiple handsets.
Until recently it has displayed the phone number (and if possible, the
corresponding name from the phone's address book) for any incoming call.
My mum went into the menus to change the time by an hour on Sunday, and
since then it only displays the text "Incoming call" with no actual number.
I can't see anything in the menus that could turn on and off the display of
the number; the only configurable option is "Talking Caller ID" where a
voice synthesiser reads out the info (that feature is turned off and always
has been). The fault exists on all the handsets, so it's not a
handset-specific problem.
One interesting thing: I got mum to change the time so it was
incorrect by a
few minutes and then call the phone from her mobile. This should have
corrected the time to "now" because that info is contained within the Caller
ID data packet. But it didn't.
The only thing that she has not been able to test yet is to try a different
phone (the old DECT phone which I think was BT8500) to see if that displays
caller ID.
Is it possible that her phone provider (Plusnet, rather than BT) could
inadvertently have turned off Caller ID on their line during the change in
the hour? Can that happen - ie is it a plausible suggestion?

We've got a KX-TG8061E. If yours is similar, their might be some display
options not accessible through the usual menu. Perhaps you can can
access these through the middle soft key (directly below the display).
Press the key and then #192.
I think there are other options through the soft key and #nnn codes, but
don't know if these (or even #192) will be of any help.
It might be worth a call to the Panasonic Dect helpline (0844 8443899
according to the manual, but it is 8 years old!) if you can't get it sorted.

We had the same phone (420E) but I ditched it when we found it will only
block 50 numbers! Other than than a brilliant phone system.
Per the # numbers, yes pretty well every Panny phone of that time has
these facilities and they are all listed in the handbook. In the
handbook on line the # instructions start at page 19 or this address:-
https://tinyurl.com/4shvckdm
Good luck!

[Tim+]

Post by Woody
We had the same phone (420E) but I ditched it when we found it will only
block 50 numbers!

Blocking numbers individually is hardly worth doing given that VOIP makes
it so easy for scammers to keep changing numbers.

A “white list” is far more effective.

Tim

[Woody]

Post by Tim+

Post by Woody
We had the same phone (420E) but I ditched it when we found it will only
block 50 numbers!

Blocking numbers individually is hardly worth doing given that VOIP makes
it so easy for scammers to keep changing numbers.
A “white list” is far more effective.

That is what we have now. First a BT4600 system of which the underlying
nuisance call system was Truecall - which worked very well.

Unfortunately they suffered the most awful audio crackling that was
speech related. It was even audible on a landline phone connected in
parallel with the base station unit. BT support insisted it must be a
landline fault, but we have NEVER had line crackle issues in the 30+
years we have lived here and still don't now.

I tripped over a four phone Panasonic system on discounted offer in JLP
in Cambridge. That one simply asks the caller to press 1 to continue
else it rejects the call. The idea is to get rid of automated checking
calls. I doubted it would work, but since we have been using it - maybe
4-5 months - we have only had one speech scam call get through (last
week.) We have had perhaps 15-20 other scam calls but the phone hasn't
sounded although the missed call number still shows.

[Tim+]

Post by Woody

Post by Tim+

Post by Woody
We had the same phone (420E) but I ditched it when we found it will only
block 50 numbers!

Blocking numbers individually is hardly worth doing given that VOIP makes
it so easy for scammers to keep changing numbers.
A “white list” is far more effective.

That is what we have now. First a BT4600 system of which the underlying
nuisance call system was Truecall - which worked very well.
Unfortunately they suffered the most awful audio crackling that was
speech related.

Yep, we get that too. Keep meaning to replace it but we find that we’re
using the landline so rarely it’s ceasing to be a problem.

Tim

[David Woolley]

Post by Tim+
Yep, we get that too. Keep meaning to replace it but we find that we’re
using the landline so rarely it’s ceasing to be a problem.

Does it actually make sense to replace analogue phone equipment with
analogue phone equipment when the end of the analogue phone network is
currently in progress (it has already happened for some

[Woody]

Post by David Woolley

Yep, we get that too.  Keep meaning to replace it but we find that we’re
using the landline so rarely it’s ceasing to be a problem.

Does it actually make sense to replace analogue phone equipment with
analogue phone equipment when the end of the analogue phone network is
currently in progress (it has already happened for some exchanges), and
is scheduled to complete by 2025.

Yes but...
The whole of this thread has been about what happens when cable goes and
fibre comes? The answer is that the fibre presentation will incorporate
an analogue connection so you will <still> be able to use your existing
analogue kit, it will just change format (to VoIP) before it leaves your
premises. Either that or a brain implant to allow you to talk in VoIP!

[Davey]

On Fri, 4 Nov 2022 08:22:03 +0000

Post by Woody

Post by David Woolley

Yep, we get that too.  Keep meaning to replace it but we find that
we’re using the landline so rarely it’s ceasing to be a problem.

Does it actually make sense to replace analogue phone equipment
with analogue phone equipment when the end of the analogue phone
network is currently in progress (it has already happened for some
exchanges), and is scheduled to complete by 2025.

Yes but...
The whole of this thread has been about what happens when cable goes
and fibre comes? The answer is that the fibre presentation will
incorporate an analogue connection so you will <still> be able to use
your existing analogue kit, it will just change format (to VoIP)
before it leaves your premises. Either that or a brain implant to
allow you to talk in VoIP!

Except, as is known, with my existing analogue kit, if there is a power
cut, I can still use my handset. But once it has to be connected to a
VoIP device and fibre network, during a power cut, it won't work, not
even as well as a piece of wet string.

[NY]

Post by Davey

Post by Woody
The whole of this thread has been about what happens when cable goes
and fibre comes? The answer is that the fibre presentation will
incorporate an analogue connection so you will <still> be able to use
your existing analogue kit, it will just change format (to VoIP)
before it leaves your premises. Either that or a brain implant to
allow you to talk in VoIP!

Except, as is known, with my existing analogue kit, if there is a power
cut, I can still use my handset. But once it has to be connected to a
VoIP device and fibre network, during a power cut, it won't work, not
even as well as a piece of wet string.

Hence the need for a small UPS to power the ONT, router and phone base
station to maintain a phone supply during short power cuts. Are those
offered as standard or as a chargeable extra by BT when they replace an
copper line with fibre?

Where I used to work (a small office of about 10 people) the phone system
used VOIP. One day there was a major power cut: the usual problem of a JCB
that dug through an underground HV cable. We were utterly stumped because
there was no power to our computers to see which customers we were due to
visit that day, and no way of phoning them (especially as the customer
records on PC were needed for the phone numbers) because the mobile phone
signals died as well (not sure why - masts are supposed to have at least
*some* battery backup).

I saved the day because I have a 12V->240V inverter in my car - a cheap
Halfords device. The boss hooked it up to the company van (with the engine
idling) and used it to drive the VOIP device (connected to a wired analogue
phone) so at least we could receive incoming calls and phone anyone whose
number we already knew.

[David Woolley]

Post by NY
Hence the need for a small UPS to power the ONT, router and phone base
station to maintain a phone supply during short power cuts. Are those
offered as standard or as a chargeable extra by BT when they replace an
copper line with fibre?

Not standard. They will provide something to vulnerable customers,
which might be a free supply. I believe that the details are
underspecified, t allow for local discretion and/or changes with time.

Virgin will provide a device that will switch to a captive mobile
connection, to vulnerable customers - I'm not sure what the power
arrangements are.

[David Woolley]

Post by Woody
The whole of this thread has been about what happens when cable goes and
fibre comes? The answer is that the fibre presentation will incorporate
an analogue connection so you will <still> be able to use your existing
analogue kit, it will just change format (to VoIP) before it leaves your
premises. Either that or a brain implant to allow you to talk in VoIP!

I don't remember any reference to Virgin. In the case of BT, my
understanding is that:

1) although there will be an analogue socket, the preferred option is
their built in DECT base station, and a free supply of compatible handsets;

2) the BT option will put the Digital Voice support in the router, not
in the fibre termination;

3) many people will get voice over ADSL, not voice over fibre.

[Tim+]

Post by David Woolley

Post by Woody
The whole of this thread has been about what happens when cable goes and
fibre comes? The answer is that the fibre presentation will incorporate
an analogue connection so you will <still> be able to use your existing
analogue kit, it will just change format (to VoIP) before it leaves your
premises. Either that or a brain implant to allow you to talk in VoIP!

I don't remember any reference to Virgin. In the case of BT, my
1) although there will be an analogue socket, the preferred option is
their built in DECT base station, and a free supply of compatible handsets;
2) the BT option will put the Digital Voice support in the router, not
in the fibre termination;
3) many people will get voice over ADSL, not voice over fibre.

If folk can’t get fibre, why would BT swap them to voice over ADSL? If they
can get fibre, why would they want to maintain fibre AND copper?

Tim

[David Wade]

Post by Tim+

Post by David Woolley

Post by Woody
The whole of this thread has been about what happens when cable goes and
fibre comes? The answer is that the fibre presentation will incorporate
an analogue connection so you will <still> be able to use your existing
analogue kit, it will just change format (to VoIP) before it leaves your
premises. Either that or a brain implant to allow you to talk in VoIP!

I don't remember any reference to Virgin. In the case of BT, my
1) although there will be an analogue socket, the preferred option is
their built in DECT base station, and a free supply of compatible handsets;
2) the BT option will put the Digital Voice support in the router, not
in the fibre termination;
3) many people will get voice over ADSL, not voice over fibre.

If folk can’t get fibre, why would BT swap them to voice over ADSL? If they
can get fibre, why would they want to maintain fibre AND copper?

It lets them get rid on the exchange equipment.

Post by Tim+
Tim

Dave

[NY]

Post by David Woolley

Post by Tim+
Yep, we get that too. Keep meaning to replace it but we find that we’re
using the landline so rarely it’s ceasing to be a problem.

Does it actually make sense to replace analogue phone equipment with
analogue phone equipment when the end of the analogue phone network is
currently in progress (it has already happened for some exchanges), and

Do fibre ONTs (or routers) that are intended partly for VOIP use have an
analogue output that can drive an existing DECT phone, or do you have to buy
new equipment that takes a digital input and then distributes it around the
house by DECT?

[Bob Eager]

Post by NY

Post by David Woolley

Post by Tim+
Yep, we get that too. Keep meaning to replace it but we find that
we’re using the landline so rarely it’s ceasing to be a problem.

Does it actually make sense to replace analogue phone equipment with
analogue phone equipment when the end of the analogue phone network is
currently in progress (it has already happened for some exchanges), and

Do fibre ONTs (or routers) that are intended partly for VOIP use have an
analogue output that can drive an existing DECT phone, or do you have to
buy new equipment that takes a digital input and then distributes it
around the house by DECT?

The ECI and Huawei ones do, but the Nokia one (I've never seen one)
doesn't.

Of course, the telephine port may be dead if not supported by your ISP.
That is the case with mine; I don't care as I've had all VoIP for years.

[David Woolley]

Post by NY
Do fibre ONTs (or routers) that are intended partly for VOIP use have an
analogue output that can drive an existing DECT phone, or do you have to
buy new equipment that takes a digital input and then distributes it
around the house by DECT?

The BT router offering has an analogue output and a built in DECT base
station. There is also an option for a remote, wall wart, analogue
interface, although I haven't worked out if that is DECT or WiFi.

BT will supply you with two simple DECT handsets, or one sophisticated
one, or wall wart, as free supply.

This may only apply to people with no existing broadband, or a BT Retail
or Plus Net one. I suspect other broadband suppliers may need to make
their own arrangements, but I haven't seen a clean statement.

[David Woolley]

Post by Tim+
Blocking numbers individually is hardly worth doing given that VOIP makes
it so easy for scammers to keep changing numbers.

That's a moving target. The UK is somewhat behind, as they are waiting
for 2025, when the analogue network is turned off, but in the USA it is
becoming very difficult to fake a caller ID without its getting flagged
as attestation B (this number doesn't belong to the originator of the
call but we know who they are), or attestation C (we've no idea who
really originated this call, but they weren't in the USA).

The expectation is that, soon, people will direct anything other than
attestation A (we are sure this number belongs to the originator of the
call) to voicemail.

Search STIR/SHAKEN, for more.

[David Wade]

Post by NY
My parents have a Panasonic KX-TGJ420E DECT phone with multiple
handsets. Until recently it has displayed the phone number (and if
possible, the corresponding name from the phone's address book) for any
incoming call.
My mum went into the menus to change the time by an hour on Sunday, and
since then it only displays the text "Incoming call" with no actual
number. I can't see anything in the menus that could turn on and off the
display of the number; the only configurable option is "Talking Caller
ID" where a voice synthesiser reads out the info (that feature is turned
off and always has been). The fault exists on all the handsets, so it's
not a handset-specific problem.
One interesting thing: I got mum to change the time so it was incorrect
by a few minutes and then call the phone from her mobile. This should
have corrected the time to "now" because that info is contained within
the Caller ID data packet. But it didn't.
The only thing that she has not been able to test yet is to try a
different phone (the old DECT phone which I think was BT8500) to see if
that displays caller ID.
Is it possible that her phone provider (Plusnet, rather than BT) could
inadvertently have turned off Caller ID on their line during the change
in the hour? Can that happen - ie is it a plausible suggestion?

Does not sound plausible, well mine still works? Has she changed thee
phone book from base station to handset?

Dave